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What will it hurt to slow down on Lone Tree Road?Posted Friday, February 19, 2010, at 2:47 PM
What is it about a common sense solution to a dangerous traffic problem that draws up the ire and comments from the general public?
Discussion and action by the Greene County Commissioners at Tuesday morning's meeting about authorizing a traffic count on Lone Tree Road -- east of Linton between State Road 54 and State Road 48, did just that. Greene County Highway Superintendent Mike Hennette told the commissioners that he had recently been contacted by several residents who live along the road to consider lowering the speed limit. They have witnesses the blatant disregard for the speed limit for a long time and they want it lowered for safety reasons. This action is not as one reader suggested a local government conspiracy to lower the speed limits on all county roads. It's a safety precaution before someone is seriously injured or killed again driving on the road. There have been accidents on the road in the past and likely will be again in the future, but a lower speed limit helps the chances of reducing that number. County police officers work a lot of wrecks every year -- more than 900 all totaled, according to the latest crash study done by the Indiana Criminal Justice Institute in 2008. Wrecks in rural areas accounted for 687 of the crashes. There were 103 wrecks inside Linton, another 77 in Bloomfield and 26 in Jasonville. The study identified the intersection of State Road 45 and State Road 54 as the most dangerous with eight wrecks, followed by State Road 54 and U.S. 231 in Bloomfield, State Road 445 and State Road 54, County Road 545 and State Road 59, State Road 445 and State Road 45, and State Road 57 and State Road 67. It is a fact that there are no posted speed limits on Lone Tree Road -- meaning the speed limit is 55, unless posted otherwise. I guess some motorists think it means unlimited speed -- similar to the famed Autobahn in Germany, where anything goes. One of our readers commented on the story that I wrote about the meeting and noted, "Come out here at 5-7 a.m. and drive 55 and you're the slow one. Its the Linton bypass." Some people wrote that a better solution would be to beef up law enforcement patrols along the roadway and start ticketing the speed violators in increasing numbers. That might slow down the vehicles some, but the reality is, the county sheriff's department doesn't have enough manpower to blanket that road. That's just a fact, money is tight in the budget and sadly there aren't enough bucks to add more officers. I guess it's true as one reader wrote, "Signs are cheaper than policemen." Under long established policy, the first step to changing a speed limit on a county road is to do a traffic count. It's pretty simple. The commissioners do the traffic count and then determine a safe lower speed, if the count warrants it. If you have driven Lone Tree Road, common sense will tell you that 55 is probably too fast on most days. The road is straight and narrow, but bumpy and it tends to flood in the spring and drift with snow in the winter. So what is the big deal about dropping the speed limit? One reader wrote that the roadway has long been one that motorists liked to violate. They wrote: "Grandpa always said that road was all yours unless you could see someone coming. Does anybody remember driving on the opposite side of the road as they crossed the culvert type bridges by the Kramer farm? Everybody went to the smoother side of the culvert. Hope you never met a six- row corn planter back in the '70s." Another reader may have summed it up best by commenting, "I have always been told if you can drive in Greene County, you can drive anywhere! I believe it. But all kidding aside, Lone Tree Road is a very dangerous road and always has been." Let's give our county officials the support they deserve and not criticize them when they try to do something like reducing a speed limit that will probably reduce injuries and could save a life. If we can't all slow down a little bit, we are probably in too big of a hurry. Nick is the assistant editor for the Greene County Daily World. He can be reached by telephone at 847-4487 or 1-800-947-4487 or by e-mail at schneider.nick@gmail.com . Comments Showing comments in chronological order [Show most recent comments first] |
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What it boils down to is that people are going to drive as fast as they feel comfortable or what they feel is safe and reasonable.
Just because some think others are driving too fast doesn't mean we need lower speed limits. I have read a lot of comments from people complaining about how fast people drive or how horrible the road is. I wonder whether Lone Tree is really unsafe or whether its just some people's opinion.
I would like to see some numbers and be able to compare to the surrounding area. If Lone Tree is indeed less safe than other areas, more attention should be paid to it but if there are a relatively small number of problems, effort is better focused elsewhere. We already can't afford summer school at Linton-Stockton so we shouldn't be throwing money around.
I'm not convinced Lone Tree is a problem and I believe we can find better things to focus on. How about making up our minds on the stupid golf cart ordinance once and for all?
Wouldn't life be easy if all we had to do to change human behavior is put up a sign. while your at it here are a few more sign ideas:
1. Don't drink and drive
2. Don't hit another person
3. Don't drive faster than 55
4. Don't murder
To think all this time we have the solution to problems right under our nose, put up a sign.
Its a hot topic because alot of people know they drive to fast on this road and others, myself included. If we all slow down a little maybe life wont pass us by so quickly.
"...the reality is, the county sheriff's department doesn't have enough manpower to blanket that road. That's just a fact, money is tight in the budget and sadly there aren't enough bucks to add more officers."
I don't think anyone would suggest to "blanket" the road. How about we prioritize our use of manpower. If we have any officers driving from Linton to Bloomfield have them swing down Lone Tree road. I know our resources are stretched as it is, I would suggest that in the worst economic times in many years we do what we can with what we have. I know many families in the county are doing the same.
These are tough times it would be nice to pay for studies and signs and officers and everything else we want. Why not try to allocate what we have already in a different manner first.
http://www.wired.com/autopia/2008/11/the...
If cops can't blanket the road now, how will they be able to enforce a lower speed limit? Even if it is 25 mph, they will still not have the manpower for enforcement. I know signs are cheap, but I have a different idea: upgrade the road to a highway status. Widen it, smooth it, and put in better drainage. Lone Tree is the most direct access point to Linton from northern Greene, southern Clay and western Owen counties. Linton is the main hub of commerce for folks in that area. Don't inconvenience thousands of citizens for the benefit of the 30-40 folks who live on the road.
Uh we don't have the money
Use the highways and try to save our county roads as much as possible in these next 5-6 weeks during the spring thaw. Remember we dont have the money to repair them
I noticed you gave quite a few statistics on county traffic accidents for 2008, including numbers associated with cities and dangerous intersections. I didn't see any numbers for Lone Tree Road. Did I miss them, or did the number not support your argument that the current speeds are too dangerous??? James30069 has a valid point--what do the actual numbers compared to other areas indicate?
And, I tend to agree with the implications of Chevygleen and RDK: What sense is there in posting signs that no one is going to obey?
That is my point 55 mph sign exist and are ignored daily. As for stats on accidents on lone tree road, my guess is they are not kept. I would think that accusations that they don't support an argument are wrong and over the line. They just don't keep stats on every accident on every road. Folks these are tough times, before we spend money we don't have let at least try to shift a little more enforcement to the area and see if that works, it costs very little and will not hurt to try it first.
All roads unless marked are 55mph by state law. Signs are not required.
I'm with RDK on his closing statement.
"Don't inconvenience thousands of citizens for the benefit of the 30-40 folks who live on the road."
I could maybe see the need for a reduction in speed, from the hospital north to Sunset Road, not the full stretch.
I have lived just off Lonetree for, just shy of 30 years. On it everyday. The wrecks are mostly caused by stupidity, people not paying attention, blathering or texting on cell phones. The near misses we have had are people driving left of center, cell phones were glued to their ears.
http://www.wired.com/autopia/2008/11/the...
Folks read that article, we all want safety, we all want cars to slow down. we don't have the money to turn it into a superhighway. We don't need to spend another dime on studies to set or lower the speed limit. It boils down to this simple fact the only way to get people to slow down to any speed you write on a sign is with enforcement. You can put negative 20 mph on a sign and it will not matter without enforcement. So if you have to enforce the limits why not try it first? All this talk about roads and signs and studies and accidents is what you do after enforcement fails. So why not try to shift some of our manpower to enforcement. Now I know we don't have an unlimited amount of manpower and our officers are busy with other tasks. What this means is we need to prioritize our resources. If your house is on fire and the TV doesn't work, you put the fire out first, if you then have no time to fix the TV you go without TV. Please read this it really boils down to the best we can do is more enforcement, if we can't do that then we should not waste money.
http://www.wired.com/autopia/2008/11/the...
Thank you, Goosepond Ghost, for those stories. I haven't been able to find articles or any other data on Lone Tree.
After we have data on accidents along Lone Tree, the next step would be to figure out whether the accidents are caused by speed, speed related or due to something other than speed.
Combining data from Nick's original blog entry to the articles from Goosepong Ghost, there have been 206 wrecks in Bloomfield, Jasonville, and Linton. AT LEAST eight of them have been on Lone Tree, and probably more but I can't find any additional stories or data.
Of the articles cited by Goosepond Ghost, two happened under snow/icy conditions, at least two were driver error or misjudgment, in one the driver wasn't wearing a seat belt and didn't see the other car, one was caused by failure to yield right-of-way. In "Three taken to hospital..." a van was rear-ended as it was turning into a driveway. In "Worthington man escapes..." the man was driving at night, didn't see the stop sign soon enough to stop at it, he overreacted and caused his vehicle to slide off the road. The article titled, "Accident closes lone tree" gave no cause or any details.
From this small, simple analysis, at least two of the eight wrecks were caused by poor weather conditions. And the others were cause by distracted driving or driver error. The articles dont' give enough info to know whether any of them were caused by (or even related to) speeding.
The first step is to determine whether the area is unsafe because of speeding or whether accidents are due to things like drivers talking on cell phones, not obeying stop signs, or tailgating.
Taking care of the road would help too, eliminating chuck holes and removing snow and ice.
My daughter in law was one of the accidents mentioned by Goosepond Ghost - it was Black Ice - I guess you can say driving faster than should be.
Lone Tree should have been updated on width, side berms, years years years ago, that would help a lot. At one time the State of Indiana was looking at it for a State Road extention. But bringing it up to state specs Greene County could not do. (1970's????)
The public will make Lone Tree Road (can we call it that with the new address issue in place) to be a big ordeal if the speed gets enforced/lowered to 45. Again I agree with you Goosepond Ghost I thought it was 45 also.
By the way GREAT ARTICLE Nick,
Good Job,
My husband usually travels that road daily to work. During bad weather conditions, I make him take the long way around thru Jasonville. He had a accident along that road last April. Not due to weather or driver error just wrong place at wrong time. It involved hitting a rather large animal that had gotten loose during the night. That road is very bumpy and uneven. It is crazy for people to drive more than the 45mph speed limit.
OK, if confession is good well then. I have drove 60 to 65 several times on 1000 West. I have drove 45 to 50 also where homes are or meeting other vehicles. I know a older lady that got stopped for speeding at 70MPH, she was not paying attention, she says. My behavoir for speeding should be punished. I am a very defensive driver but it takes just split second for 1 mistake then it is a lot of paperwork time.
Best advice slow down.
I wonder if "concerned mom 2"'s husband really takes the long way around in bad weather or if he is fibbing to the bride and takes the Lone Tree Short Cut??
Good grief. Just put us in padded suits and lock us all in our homes. Maybe then everyone will feel safe enough. I've driven on Lone Tree Road for 47 years and I've never felt unsafe. [and yes, I still take the wrong side at the culvert by Kramer's] When did we become such a nation of whiners?
After all these comments Ellie said it best, why is it?